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April 30, 2007 8:15 AM PDT

Checking for Bad RAM; problems can be indirect

by CNET staff
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Faulty RAM modules can cause a variety of problems and can come from any vendor -- including Apple. Furthermore, the problems caused by bad memory can be latent, developing over time, and/or non-specific.

A recent e-mail from MacFixIt reader Rock Norris exemplifies the aforementioned -- his faulty RAM shipped was supplied by Apple at the time of his MacBook Pro's purchase, and the detrimental effects developed slowly.

Rock writes:

"In December, my wife and I bought a MacBook Pro, and had it come with 2 GB out of the box. The machine ran fine most of the time, but my wife began to find more and more issues as time wore on and her use of it increased. Eventually, we started getting incessant hangs, unexpected quits, and then, after a couple of weeks, the occasional kernel panic. [...] I tried to do a clean archive and install and start cleaning things up. That's when things got interesting. The install would not complete, and seemed to take forever to complete the first part (disc 1). This left our laptop in a state of half-installed, and of course would not boot correctly, or even fully mount, even in Target Disk mode on our older G4 tower. [...] I finally ran the Apple Hardware Test disc. Running through the main test, it turned out one of the RAM modules failed. Hearing this, AppleCare was ready to send out a replacement module, but we had a local AppleCare Service Rep and decided to let him do the repair since it was all covered.

"The problem here is that the bad RAM doesn't always result in a kernel panic immediately. Sometimes it's severely slowed overall operation, or spinning beachball, or unexpected quits, and then maybe kernel panics. And it's very intermittent, too. If your usage of the hardware's RAM is very light, you may not run across the issue often."

Among the issues that can be caused by bad RAM:

There are three primary methods for identifying and eliminating problematic RAM modules:

Run the Apple Hardware Test This is the simplest method and should be used first.

To run the Apple Hardware Test on PowerPC-based Macs, insert the Apple Hardware Test disc, then shut down the system. Restart your Mac then immeidately hold down the C key until the "Loading..." icon appears.

To use the Apple Hardware Test disc on Intel-based Macs, insert the disc labeled "Mac OS X Install Disc 1". Resetart your Mac then immediately hold down the D key before the gray startup screen appears. You should see a picture of a screen with a chip in front of it.

Once the program hardware test program has loaded, select the Perform extended testing checkbox then press the Test button. If the test discovers faulty modules, it will display an explicit message indicating which slot harbors it.

Use a third-party RAM testing utility If the Apple Hardware Test does not discover faulty modules but you still suspect that bad RAM is the cause f your issue(s), you can try a third-party RAM testing utility. The most popular tool for this procedure is Memtest -- a command line utility. There is also a graphical interface application driven by Memtest called Rember.

For information on using both of these utilities, see this "Troubleshooting Tools" column.

Remove modules one-by-one or in sets If neither of the above procedures identifies a faulty module(s), and you still think bad RAM might be your problem (neither aforementioned method is capable of identifying bad RAM in all cases), you may want to try the manual approach:

  1. Pull all RAM modules except one (or two if your Mac requires paired RAM)
  2. Check for persistence of the problem(s)
  3. If the problem is gone, add the removed modules back one at a time (or two at a time if your Mac requires pairs), restarting your Mac each time to check if the problem recurs; If the problem is not gone, switch the module out with one (or two) of the remaining modules and check for elimination of the problem until you've identified the problematic module(s)

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    by pixolab April 30, 2007 8:22 AM PDT
    Bad RAM is one of the various reasons I run AHT for *at least* 24 hours (control-L to loop on Extended) on any new Mac before it gets deployed. I've picked up on several intermittently bad pieces of RAM and logic boards before deploying to a user.
    Reply to this comment
    by Mark Douma April 30, 2007 9:45 AM PDT
    "This left our laptop in a state of half-installed, and of course would not boot correctly, or even fully mount, even in Target Disk mode on our older G4 tower."

    Not sure of the details on what the failure to mount involved on your older G4, but keep in mind this Knowledge Base article: Intel-based Macs: "You have inserted a disk containing no volumes that Mac OS X can read" alert message
    Reply to this comment
    by kucharsk April 30, 2007 11:43 AM PDT
    Don't forget to swap around DIMMs if you can. The problem with AHT is that it can't test the memory module the OS is occupying. The only way to do that is to swap DIMMs so that different areas of physical memory are mapped to different physical DIMMs.
    Reply to this comment
    by baddawg65 April 30, 2007 12:20 PM PDT
    Bad RAM can also manifest itself as a system that cannot go to sleep. I had two systems, aa 12-inch PowerBook G4 and a 15-inch MacBookPro Core Duo, that had these symptoms of not going to sleep on the PowerBook I sent it in under AppleCare 5 times before one 2nd level tech try a suggestion of swapping RAM and it was the RAM going bad. Apple sent me a replacement RAM for the PowerBook and all is well for the PowerBook.
    The MacBookPro was exhibiting similar symptoms but took longer to discover since the symptoms took longer to show up but I had Apple replace the RAM and all is well on the MacBookPro.
    Even though Apple Hardware Test (AHT) checks the hardware fairly well on the machine, it really doesn't give absolute answer for all problems.
    Reply to this comment
    by Zeds Dead April 30, 2007 3:20 PM PDT
    Recently I had RAM go bad in my Mac Pro in an extremely disturbing way. One RAM module failed completely (and silently) resulting in a red LED on the riser that followed that chip around. Plus, the machine was only reporting 1gb of RAM instead of 2gb.

    Here's the kicker though: I rebooted into AHT and it said NOTHING WAS WRONG!!! I looped about 4 times and it claimed all RAM was functioning normally, despite that fact that one module was completely dead according to the riser board itself. Very, very frustrating!

    I just installed AppleJack today with the memtest optional install and plan to run some more tests on this machine during evening hours as I've had one FB Unrecoverable Memory Error kernel panic with the replacement RAM I was sent for the failed module...
    Reply to this comment
    by robintosh April 30, 2007 3:20 PM PDT
    >
    This is a reply to a previous comment by Zeds Dead


    Maybe the board disabled the module and that's why AHT cannot see it to check it.
    Reply to this comment
    by Zeds Dead April 30, 2007 3:20 PM PDT
    >>
    This is a reply to a previous comment by robintosh


    I suppose so, but it showed all 4 RAM modules and claimed the computer had 2gb while in AHT mode, so I'm not sure... at the very least, it would have been nice to see an error message about it after finishing the test run.

    Basically, I have been having minor issues with some of the Mac Pro RAM and so far AHT hasn't caught anything. I always run the RAM in AHT for 8+ hours of testing before moving it out to production, but so far AHT has detected nothing and yet I have been getting plenty of KPs via the "Uncorrectable Fbd memory error detected" error message from RAM that tests fine according to AHT.
    Reply to this comment
    by ushooz April 30, 2007 3:20 PM PDT
    >
    This is a reply to a previous comment by Zeds Dead


    I have similar problems with original Mac Pro RAM. The trend I have noticed so far seems to be when the system has some sort of load. Example encoding Video with FCP or when I goof off and play World of Warcraft. I do not use the machine for general duties as I have other machines for such tasks. Primary function of the machine is FCP and it is quiet frustrating to have it Kernel Panic.
    When I look at the logs it always has a memory issue with an FBDimm. I have run the Apple Diagnostics with no faulty memory shown. I have swapped the memory around to reseat the memory and the riser cards just incase. Still have the problem. Guess I will have to call Apple.

    Machine is an original 4 core 2.66 Mac Pro not one of the new 8 core beasts.
    Reply to this comment
    by macmatthew May 20, 2007 9:58 AM PDT
    I have been having the same exact problems!!!!!!!
    omg, it was so frustrating. I thought maybe it was just because i only had the standard 512 ram so i upgraded and when i took the old ram out, it had shown serious signs of wear. There was white stuff all over the golden part of the ram and the white stuff extended into the main part of the ram about 1mm. I know this was the problem because my computer feels like new now and once again i can multi task without having the beach ball spin on me.
    Reply to this comment
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