Safari connectivity and Security Update 2004-09-30 (and OS Updates in general)
A number of times over the past four to six months, we've published user reports of Safari connectivity problems after installing an OS update. In each case, these reports describe issues where Safari can't connect to some sites on the first try, but (for most users) will eventually load the desired page after several tries. Our most recent such report, yesterday, was the result of a significant number of people who have experienced this problem -- coincidentally or not -- after installing Security Update 2004-09-30.
As we previously stated, Security Update 2004-09-30 was a relatively minor update in terms of the number of files replaced; specifically, the Update only changed files relating to NetInfo Manager, File Sharing, QuickTime, postfix, and cupsd. None of these files should affect Safari connectivity. (Similarly, in many of the previous cases where users reported these problems after installing an update, that update should not have affected Safari.) In addition, whenever we post such reader reports, we inevitably get a number of messages from other readers stating that they had the problem before installing the update or are currently experiencing the problem even though they haven't installed the update. So there's no clear link between such updates and these problems (and, technically, we can find no obvious link, given the files installed by the update).
However, the fact of the matter is that we've seen an enormous increase in the frequency of these reports since the release of Security Update 2004-09-30 -- too many for it to be just a coincidence. In the past 24 hours, for example, we've received well over 100 messages describing similar Safari connectivity issues, nearly all of them noting that the problem only started after installing this particular Security Update. There are also many similar reports on message boards, forums, and mailing lists around the 'net.
Frankly, we're stumped at the moment. Although the Security Update shouldn't be affecting Safari connectivity, the two seem to be highly correlated, if not explicitly related by cause/effect. As a result, we've been combing through reader mail trying to find any patterns or details that might help narrow down the true nature of this issue.
One thing that does stand out when reading these reports is the common behavior of these connectivity issues. In nearly all cases, Safari cannot reach a particular site or sites on the first try, but subsequent tries will eventually produce a successful connection. In our experience, this type of behavior most commonly occurs when the OS is having DNS (domain name system) problems. (All servers on the Internet have a dedicated IP address, which is how your computer connects to them to request data, such as a Web page. The DNS system is what allows you to type in "cnn.com" instead of the CNN server's actual IP address -- a DNS server converts "cnn.com" into 64.236.16.84, or whatever the actual IP address might be.) When a DNS problem occurs, your computer cannot properly translate website domain names into the appropriate IP address, so you get an error.
Comments from readers seem to support a DNS-related problem (see the DNS-related suggestions below). Reader Joe Foley writes, "Safari fails to connect on the first try about 50% of the time but (so far) is successful on the second try 100% of the time using the reload button...It seems to be a more frequent problem with the first page from a site. Linked pages on the same site may be more likely to open on the first try." This behavior is consistent with DNS hiccups -- once your computer successfully connects to a DNS server to associate a particular IP address with a domain name, subsequent requests to that domain should also be successful (at least until Safari needs to query the DNS server again).
Suggested causes/solutions Readers have presented a number of theories and suggestions to try to explain this issue, or at least to try to work around it:
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Safari DNS cache? What is especially peculiar about this issue (besides the fact that it seems to occur so frequently after installing an OS update) is that whereas DNS problems usually affect all Internet clients -- Web browsers, email clients, streaming audio software, etc. -- for most users, this problem seems to affect only Safari. Indeed, many readers report that switching to another browser, such as
Firefox or OmniWeb, allows them to load the affected site(s). Reader Allan Doyle suggests an explanation:
"I have noticed that Safari seems to have an internal DNS cache that is slow to update because when I do DNS changes on my web servers I have to restart Safari to get it to see the new sites even after I get the new DNS info in a terminal session using 'host'."
If this is the case, the workaround (quitting Safari each time it happens) would seem to be a significant hassle, given how frequently those experiencing this problem see it.
[Note that not all users are seeing this issue only with Safari; several MacFixIt readers have reported that it also affects Firefox and Netscape. However, these readers are in the minority.]
Manually entering DNS addresses Steven Smith suggests a different approach: If you're using a DHCP connection through your ISP, manually enter your ISPs DNS server IP address(es) in the Network preferences pane of System Preferences. (When using DHCP, this information is generally supplied by your ISP's DHCP server.) The downside to this workaround is that if your ISP's DNS servers ever change, you'll need to manually update those addresses.
[As a side note, one of the first explanations we considered was that perhaps certain ISPs were having DNS issues: Perhaps, in the case of Security Update 2004-09-30, several of the main DNS routers on the 'net started behaving erratically at approximately the same time Apple released the update. However, that wouldn't seem to explain why this issue mainly affects Safari, and it also wouldn't explain why some users with multiple computers see the issue on one computer but not on another. For example, Richard Pockat writes, "I have noticed this to an annoying extent on one machine and little or none on another. The first machine is a 2Ghz Dual, the second an original flat screen iMac. Both were updated with software update."]
Trailing slash related? For MacFixIt reader Tom Burke, the issue only occurs when he types in a URL without a trailing slash: "I have the same problem. It happens when a URL has a backslash at the end. If you delete the backslash, the page will load. I never realized how often URLs had the backslash at the end." In other words, typing a URL as "www.cnn.com/" won't work, but "www.cnn.com" will.
Incomplete URLs related? Reader Wayne Rugenstein reports that the issue is especially common when he simply types a website's domain without the leading "www" or trailing "net/com/org/etc":
"I am having the same connection issue with Safari after installing the latest security update, getting the 'Can't find x server' error message. This is especially happening when I just type in the name of a website without using the 'www.' and '.com' part of an address. If I try to go to MacFixit for example I would normally just type in 'macfixit' in my URL address line and hit return and let Safari add the 'http://www.' and '.com' part, but now I usually need to type this out as well for it to work properly."
As we have never experienced this issue in-house here at MacFixIt, we can't verify any of these theories or suggested workarounds. We would appreciate feedback from readers as to their effectiveness. Drop us an email at Late-breakers@macfixit.com.
Resources
year) in Safari, but it only happened occasionally. However, recently, it has
become unbearable. I'm not sure when it really started to get bad, but the
2004-09-30 Security could quite likely be the culprit.
I'm not exaggerating when I say that 80% of the time when I try to access a
site for the first time after launching Safari, I get the "Safari can't find the
server" message. If I try to load the same site again, it loads 99% of the time.
It's bad enough that I'm seriously considering switching to another browser.
Let me add that I'm on a dual 2Ghz G5 with a DSL connection to my ISP. I
have a couple of Haxies installed, including Little Snitch.
I've been having the same problems after installing the last three security
updates at the same time. Safari will often not resolve the DNS but almost
always does so on the second try.
<p>
I've also had sporadic problems with Mail, and even on the latest version of
Firefox (haven't tried Exploder).
<p>
I did run the terminal command and it seemed to help.
the same behaviour (i.e. two attempts often needed) with, for
instance, Software Update via the Apple menu, and Norton's Live Update.
---
Andreas
As noted by another reader... removing the forward slash at the end of URLs
allows Safari to connect (also for me). With the slash included at the end the
page will sometimes not load.
Regarding the Safari connectivity issue, one can confirm that the issue does
not appear to be browser related but DNS related. Open Network Utility and
select the Lookup tab. Enter a site that you have not been to yet today, in my
case, www.cnn.com and you will note that it takes 1-3 seconds or more to
get a result. This suggests to me that the timeout for Safari is shorter than
the time it takes to look up the DNS information which is why the second time
one tries, it works immediately. One can re-create the lookup issue in
Terminal too using the command nslookup.
In my case I have not installed the update and still have the problem It occurs
most with Safari but also with IE. Is it possible this is Airport related?
time I click on the link. The second click always gets through. Doesn't happen
every time, perhaps every 3rd or 4th time. I'm using a G5. Recently
downloaded and installed SafariSpeed. Thought maybe it was causing this
problem, so I trashed it. Problem still exists. Sorry (and glad too) that I'm not
the only one with this problem. Hope Apple fixes it quickly!
try running "lookupd -flushcache" in a terminal window. you should see an
improvement.
maybe apple will resolve this issue sometime soon.
nate's suggestion to run
lookupd -flushcache
in terminal corrected the problem immediately for me.
my ISP (Cox Kansas) in the Network Settings and on my router:
68.230.242.25 (primary)
68.230.242.30 (secondary)
Brent
in my case though, it is not limited to Safari, certain websites will not load
reporting "can't find <url>"
when I do a DNS check, the IP being reported is different then other people
who can load the URL in question.
eventually, sometimes minutes, sometimes as long as the next day, it will
work, and when I check the IP address (DNS lookup) I get the IP others have
had.
so in my case, it appears to be tied to DNS issues either with Mac OS X in
general, or my ISP (or even a combination of both)
I do not see this often, but it does seem to hit certain websites repeatedly
connectivity problems dating back to OS 10.3.1 or 10.3.2. I typically get this
type of problem only 1-3% of the time. Fortunately, after reading all the
reports here I decided not to apply Security Update 2004-09-30 or its
immediate predecessor, and Safari continues to work well for me.
Thanks again. This community effort spares other readers from learning
lessons the hard way.
update. The only problem I ever had is when Apple changed the version
number to a non-standard version not recognized by some sites. Apple fixed
that problem with an updated security release. So maybe it is a third-party
issue that conflicts with the Safari connection issues.
Strange.
problems occur on the one where i did not yet repair the authorizations and
not on the other.Maybe this is pure luck?
updates installed on both of his computers and has absolutely no issues with
Safari connectivity. No shareware utilities for either the System or Safari have
been added and there are no Menu Extras that access the internet. I'm
thinking that some of these additions are interacting with DNS in some
negative way for systems having this issue.
---
psr
OSX and Safari. My intial reaction was that there were a lot of miscues in
connecting. I've installed all of the system upgrades, repairng pemissions
before and after each upgrade. My feel is that the problem grew worse with
the latest security upgrade. I ran a test by selecting 50 sites from my favorites
menu and got 20% "could not find server" errors. All connected on second try.
There did not seem to be a pattern of .com/ or extended address sites. The
problem seems to be even worse when entering keywords to select a site. For
me this isn't a huge problem because I always get a connection on the second
try but Safari surely isn't working as smoothly as it should.
RHW
IE and when selecting Software Update. Nearly always gets through second
time though..
- by ebenspanger October 31, 2004 8:48 AM PST
- <class="merchant"><span>></span><div class="datestamp"><i>This is a reply to a previous comment by martinjames--2008</i></div></class><br />
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Showing 1 of 2 pages (24 Comments)same problem with firefox regardless of updates